apu Posted February 9, 2011 Report Share Posted February 9, 2011 I put the title of this post like that cause I think Richard is the most skilled one when it comes with simcloth, but anyone should feel free to try this test. Attached there is an animator file of a man walking. I'm trying to dress him with a gown type clothing. I've been racking my brain trying to get the settings right, so simcloth would not break the geometry in weird triangles, but I can't get it right. If anyone can help I've very greatful Thanks!!ANIMATOR.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJoly Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 Apu, I cannot open your file for you use Alonzo's Salesman rig to animate your character. I will have to check if I still have this rig at home tonight. Anyway, I made a new project using your models and animated it with some simple deforms. It seems to work all right. The cloth might be touching the character in the initial setup. If so, you should move it a bit up before doing the simulation. I used springs for the cloth behaviour, Stretch and shear will hang the cloth closer to the body. A tolerance of .5 will bring the costume closer too. Here are my SimCloth setups: http://www.rdnmultimedia.com/eias/Tio.mov http://www.rdnmultimedia.com/eias/Tio.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apu Posted February 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 Hi Richard. I was playing with the settings and it worked right until the salesman started to walk, when his arms where passing near the body, that's when the weird polygons flying all over the place happened. I guess you can only check what I'm telling you when you open the project with the guy walking. Attached I send you the models so you can open it. Thank you again!!!Model Folder.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJoly Posted February 14, 2011 Report Share Posted February 14, 2011 Apu, I played extensively with the file over the weekend to no avail. I have to say it's consistent though... The geometry explode around the same frame... Sorry I couldn't come with a solution, I tried with a fresh Silo model, tried with a denser mesh all with same problem. I'm suspecting the error occurs when the cloth gets squeezed in the armpits. But as I don't know the answer, everything is suspicious...:( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apu Posted February 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 Yes Richard, thanks for trying. the same problem ocurred to me. About frame 30 or something, the geometry of the simcloth messes up and becomes a bunch of weird polygons. You are right, it gets like that when it gets too bent, just when the arms pass near the torso. Pity, because that means no clothing characters can be made. Just simple stuff. Grrrrrrrr!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJoly Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 I think we can Apu. Alonzo made a clothed walking character awhile back. Maybe he could give some pointers. The bunching might not be the problem. The bunching with these models seems problematic. Maybe retopologise the character so it has a simpler mesh under the arms. In the first Shreck "making of" they had the exact same problem (exploding polys) but they don't say how they fixed it... Try a booted Silo man with less polys, I didn't try that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apu Posted February 16, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 Actually I was trying with a denser mesh, so de deformations under the arms are smoother. It runs till frame 60 without exploding. Last time it was frame 44, so I gained 16 frames!!!. I'm still testing, let se if I can come up with something. Alonzo, pleeease, give us some tips!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plehrack Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 Just a guess, but perhaps from one frame to the next, the geometry moves through the cloth causing the issue. Any thoughts on doubling the FPS and rendering every other frame? Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apu Posted February 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2011 I haven't tried that. I'll give it a shot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJoly Posted February 24, 2011 Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 I can't pinpoint the problem. The cloth itself can take quite a beating but, when squeezed, it will eventually "explode". I wish I knew why... http://www.rdnmultimedia.com/eias/Cloth_error.zipbend.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apu Posted February 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 Thanks richard for your time. I've given up on it. It's exploding everytime I run a simulation. It takes too much time. I hope that in a near future EIAS will come with a softbody simulator more stable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuzzLightyear Posted February 24, 2011 Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 Hey Richard - In my experience with SimCloth, if a model "explodes" it's because the scale of the object is too small (the math goes nuts if the object vertices are too close together). I'd try scaling everything up by a factor of 10 or 15. That usually fixes the problem for me :-) Chip The cloth itself can take quite a beating but, when squeezed, it will eventually "explode". I wish I knew why... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apu Posted February 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 Hi Buzz talking about scale, what's a good scale for a person if I'm gonna cloth it?. In EI units. Because in the project that I posted the human model was about 130 EI units. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJoly Posted February 25, 2011 Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 Some day someone will come in and say hey guys you simply forgot to do this simple thing before the simulation... Well, I tried V7, V8, V9 with various cloth behavior and sizes but eventually the cloth explodes... I'll give it a rest for now... 1000X1500Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 2000X3000Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 2000X3000 not squeezed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuzzLightyear Posted February 25, 2011 Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 Well, I tried V7, V8, V9 with various cloth behavior and sizes but eventually the cloth explodes... Hmmm.., I just downloaded the files and I'll see if I can get it to behave. Chip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuzzLightyear Posted March 4, 2011 Report Share Posted March 4, 2011 Hi apu, Well…, after two days of trying everything I could think of to get the cloth to behave, I’ve learned a few things. The mesh on the dress looked great, but it just wouldn’t stop exploding. I tried another simpler mesh I made in Maya, but it also came apart. It seems to be more predictable if self intersections is turned on, but I varied everything I could, and I could never get the sim to go beyond 58 frames. On a whim today, I decided to minimize the cloth mesh to essentially a poncho (flat plane with square hole for head). After a lot of guessing at the inputs, I did finally get the sim to run for 198 frames before it blew up. The mesh was made in Maya, and EI doesn’t like the normals. (I tried a poncho made in the EI Modeler, and it looked great. But it blew up much sooner.) Clearly, SimCloth is verrry particular about the mesh used. My final results aren’t great; the intersection distance is still far away from the body, and the only reason the sim made it to frame 195 is because the arm motion pushes the cloth away from the knees at just the right time to avoid collisions. When the knees hit the cloth coming at them, that’s were I find the intersections increase, and it explodes. I really wanted to see your original cloth data on the model, but I really don’t think SimCloth is up to it. It’s a great plugin for basic cloth, but clearly it needs a lot of refinement. The math could use some work for interactions with complex geometry. The files below are super sensitive to changes in the input values, and blows up if you change gravity, stretch, damping, or just about anything else! But it’s cool to watch even as is. (If you hand keyframed the walk cycle, you are my hero! Super nice! :-) ChipPONCHO TEST.movPANCHO TEST.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apu Posted March 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 4, 2011 Pretty cool!!! Hahahaha, no, I'm not your hero. I didn't animate the model. It's the walk cycle by Alonzo (the merit is his). I just attached a simple person model to the bones, just for the fun of trying to see if we could do clothing on EIAS. After trying, and trying, and trying, it's like you say. SimCloth is a great plug in for basic clothing, but as far as clothing people, it's not so great. By the way, great sim!!!!. It looks great!!!. I did some sims changing the gown to a simple cape, and it looked fine. But couldn't control it very well (The cape turned around his neck). And I had another problem. In the sim, and preview, the clothind didn't intersect the body, but when I did the render it was happening all the time. The preview didn't exactly match the final render (I had the same subdivisions for animator and camera), and I don't know why. Anyway, thanks alot for your time. I guess all of us have learned some new stuff playing with it. I hope someday soon someone will release a new simcloth version more stable. It's so fun to play with soft body dynamics!!!! Thank you!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuzzLightyear Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 Thanks for the challenge apu, I’m sure there will be plenty of soft body dynamics coming for EI in the future, so we’ll all have a lot of new “toys†to play with in Animator :-))) I look forward to them too, so we’ll all just have to stay tuned to see what Tomas and the Igors have in the works for us! Chip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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