Integrated Modeler

[WHD]

Hi All

On my wish list for a while now has been an integrated modeler. I know that this has been discussed now for years. When I started using 3D I was using Strata Pro back in 1992 or 93. When I came to EIAS the most difficult issue was that my animation process at the time utilized the power of integrated modeling tools . Abandoning that was very difficult. Every time I needed to make a change or tweek I'd have to go elsewhere re-export, re-import and in some cases redo a lot of work because the model issue did not appear until after I had committed much time to the scene.

Many of the tools I use to create animation now are really simplified forms of modeling tools and many of my current jobs would benefit from the power integrated tools. I dream of being able to apply keyframes in a Silo like environment manipulating vertices within EIAS.

I'm aware that this is not an easy task in EIAS due to certain structural issues of the current code but an integrated modeler would not only give us modeling tools but serious animating power as well and address one of the biggest deficiencies that the program currently has .

Bill Dempsey

[MickaelBehn]

What about instead of a full modeler (because im assuming that is a huge undertaking) inside EIAS but rather tools that allow you to modify the imported models. Something that could modify facets and points of a model. This would be great for tweaking.

Just throwing that out there.

[WHD]

Hi Mickael,

I don't expect this to be an EIAS 9 thing. As you said and most would agree it is most certainly too involved for that. But if the infrastructure could be built and some elementary functions added it would most certainly be a good start. Then features could be added over time with EIAS versions.

The foundation for this alone is most certainly a huge project. I hope that users will be willing to recognize that for the time and effort of the programmers this will not result in a full featured modeler right away. It may even just have to start as a hidden under the hood thing for EIAS 9 and be worked on a little bit over several versions to spread the cost and make it viable.

I just see this as a critical feature for EIAS's future survival. If you look at all the really big successful 3D applications now it seems they all have integrated modeling functions while those without are slowly being left behind.

Bill

[RichardJoly]

You are a very patient man Bill. I know a couple of programmers who would love all users where like that...:rolleyes:

[MickaelBehn]

Hi Bill I completely agree with you on making it integrated and done bit by bit over time. It also avoids the onslaught support for a huge new feature within EIAS when there are a lot of little improvements to be made with other part of it.

here's hoping

You are a very patient man Bill. I know a couple of programmers who would love all users where like that...:rolleyes:

[KurtF]

Agreed. Build up to an integrated modeling solution.

First tools could be very basic, fixing flipped normals, welding verts, setting shading angles (which currently have to be established upon import).

[hobnoble]

Would need Illustrator import for simple extrusions.

[Igors]

Hi All

Please don't consider this post as something "official", here we just want to say/share our opinion. We always thought an "inegrated modeler" is a nice idea - but it's same hard (maybe impossible) to implement.

For debelopers the problem is a "business scissors" (or other term in English) with this work. For example a tool to show model artifacts, "rat" places and/or "holes" in meshes, ability to visualize and modify vertices normals etc. Nice too IMOl, but, speaking realistically. there are zero chances to have it here. Why? Let's count what do we want from eventual developer:

- real-time OGL preview (so +job)

- ability to have different model's views (like front, side, orbit etc) (so +job)

- (unavoidable) ability to select something to modify it ("just view" makes no big sense) (so ++job)

etc. etc

This list can be really long. but for any developer it's already enough to understand - there is a very solid portion of work. What are developer's reasons/interests to take this stone on their necks? And a normal answer is: it makes a sense to do such things in bounds of standalone/universal app (for all users) - but there are no enthusiasts to "project" this plan to any concrete app (no matter how big it is). Because "wide things" can be done only for "wide market". So no any "inegration".

We saw a lot of attempts to change this order (with megatons of demagogy, "public opinion", intimidation, promising etc-etc) - but no one lucky :rolleyes: Either developeres have "their interest" and do their work - or not. No way to "push" them.

[Mark Johnston]

This is a subject that was beat to death on the old forum . Don't a need repeat of that. Get pro animator from Zaxwerks.com to export fac.s of illustrator shapes. I think this works good. If you make money from your work the cost should be easy to justify. I know you guy's want way more then that.

I say , this is not important, unless number of users can be increased to justify cost of doing it. IT just sounds like to hard to do, and is it really that important. At this Time.

[hobnoble]

Not really looking for a full modeler. For simple motion graphics projects we use ProModeler to extrude the shapes for logos, but the workflow is a pain to have to open ProModeler to do a couple of extrusions. It would just be nice to save the time of opening another program to do a basic extrusion, do an export and finally import it into animator. We use other modelers for bigger projects, but is the little ones that seem to be so inefficient. It certainly is not the highest on our priority list, but would be a nice time saver for basic projects.

[bwcc]

an integrated modeler would be a lot of work, and at this point I would be satisfied with improvements to the existing products.

Direct FACT export from as many existing modelers as possible: Modo, Rhino, Maya, etc.

Ability to update or replace a model from within EIAS.

Expand capabilities of UberShape, just being able to set a bevel/round on the edges of solids would be great. I use Mrs. Bebel and Mr. Revolver but we really need bezier curves to create the profiles. Some way to import Illustrator files for extrusion (with bevel/round edges) and revolve.

This one would be more work, but worth it. The ability to import directly a nurbs model like an ACIS SAT, then be able to set the tessellation in EIAS. Tessellation settings could even be animated based on distance from the camera.

I can live without a integrated modeler for now but EIAS should do everything possible to work better with other modelers.

[KurtF]

What are developer's reasons/interests to take this stone on their necks? And a normal answer is: it makes a sense to do such things in bounds of standalone/universal app (for all users) - but there are no enthusiasts to "project" this plan to any concrete app (no matter how big it is). Because "wide things" can be done only for "wide market". So no any "inegration".

Hello Igors, and thank you for posting this response to the question of an integrated modeler within EIAS. I have been waiting for nearly a year to figure out what direction EIAS would take under its new management.

I now have that answer.

Thanks again.