Daz4 using animate2 mdd output?

[Mark Johnston]

Hi I just loaded Daz 4 and I noticed the animate2 plugin says it has mdd export. I have not had a chance to try this but I hope it works cause animate2 looks like it finally brings better animation to daz studio, and I hope whose animations can be brought into EIAS. Any one had a chance to try this yet.

Mark

[Mark Johnston]

Hi I had success exporting to modo but not to EI. I'll keep trying . Mark

[Mark Johnston]

HI everyone, What would you select in theses settings and what steps would you use to convert after that say in object to fact? Thanks

Mark

[RichardJoly]

Mark,

I have no experience with Daz but I would probably use the same settings for Obj export.

When converting with Obj2Fact, Ian suggesting this setting:

[Mark Johnston]

HI Richard thanks for reply I had those settings some where and forget where for obj to fact. I have fbx export and obj from daz but so far no luck getting one of them to work right I get a lot of unexpected token in obj file warnings and in fbx converter not enough parameters, and in object to fact sometimes says somethings wrong with mt file.Same old problems. But I'am also not really sure how you set up the MDD plugin .I got it to work in modo just by luck cause it had been awhile since I had looked at modo . But also daz had 3 types of export forMDD, export for Light wave export for modo and export for dazs own format. Like I don't know for sure how the model should look when it comes in I assume it should still be in all its parts not one object like a lot of times when I try to convert model is just one part and other times it seems to have repeats of parts that don't seem correct .

Thanks for any help anyone can suggest.

Mark

---

HI model all one part doesn't work with MDD.

Mark

[Mark Johnston]

Hi I made a cube in Daz export the model and an MDD of an animation to the cube to modo add a deformer hit play and the MDD I made in daz made it fly around.TRY to use same cube and MDD in eias with MDD plugin and nothing happens.

Mark

[RichardJoly]

Have you put your MDD file in the EI Socket folder?

[Mark Johnston]

Hi yeah did that. try this link to get files for box

https://public.me.com/markjohnston99me

and see if you have any luck Thanks

Mark

Anyone who doesn't have Daz 4 you can download the basic version for free right now at

http://www.daz3d.com/i/software/daz_studio/getting_started?

Mark

[Mark Johnston]

Hi I put 2 more examples that work in modo but don't in eias, 1 has ammd aobj amt second has bmmd bobj bmt files in my public folder

1 is akio 30second forward walk second is genesis 30 second walk,

as I say both work in modo but not in eias.

If you want to take look and see if you can find out why they can be downloaded at my site

Mark

[Diego]

Hi Mark,

I just did a test with your files, A and B.

There is a very good trick I was taught from The Igors set display to point or point shadded. This way you can see the MDD file even if in phong view you see nothing.

In the example 1 and 2 you have to multiply by 0.01 your model when you import it. This also happens to me when importing from C4D.

I was able to open your example # 1 without problems in EIAS just multiply by 0.01 in the importing process, but the example # 2 do not match such frames. because you export the model in the frame 2 instead of frame 0.

Be careful when you export the MDD and the .Obj geometry you have to be in the FIRST frame of the animation, if not will not match to MDD EIAS Plugin.

Hope this help.

Cheers

Diego

[Mark Johnston]

HI Thanks Diego for taking a look and happy birthday. Yeah I watched your tutorials on vimeo on this subject and was looking at the instructions for the plugin and saw about the point shaded and I spent yesterday trying to get the amount of vertices to match in plugin and model and noticed if I calculate normals in obj to fact is checked vertices number don't match. I also had seen a video of using animate and it said to export the model at its lowest subdivison ,I did not do this in the examples I Got to work in modo. The video on animate also said scaling is important but I have had, no idea what it should be. Until yesterday the model would go away every time I parented it to the plugin and I didn't know about the point shaded and how to debug .But in most of my tries the model vertices weren't matching so now as I said, I turned off calculate normals and vertices matched, which then i was able to set to point shade which then I was able to debug in the plugin and it just went through frames and said no match found. So thats where I was yesterday and I just checked to see if there was a mdd log file in the sockets folder but I don't see one. Did you use the log file to figure what was wrong on these examples or just make educated guess and it worked? Any way at this point I will try your suggestions and see if it works for me .

Thanks very much for help Diego this ones been a real brain twister so far for me. Thanks

Mark

[Diego]

Hi Mark, I use the point shaded view mode each time that my model disappears when I link it to the MDDplugin, thus activating and deactivating the plugin you can see the differences between your geometry and MDD data.

In your case I found two things:

1._Your model was 100 times larger than the MDD data.

2._ the second file (genesis) was not synchronized with MDD Data. Because you have to be in the FIRST frame of your animation when you export your .Obj in your animation program.

Once you pick up the mechanics will find it incredibly easy, we bring models of 500,000 polygons with MDD and there is no problem.

Gave the ability to export the MDD Data from EIAS could be a great way to bake dynamics animations.

Diego

[Mark Johnston]

Hi Diego I tried the suggestions you made and it worked so I like it!!!!!!!!

I tried to put texture on it but I think I must not have uv's on model because its not working.

I made so many different versions of the model I had one that worked so just a little more work I guess.

This is just a base model if I have a model that also has clothes on it does this mean you have to have a mdd for each article of clothes and hair or it is all treated as one model with one mdd if you get what I mean.

Thanks Mark

[Diego]

Hi Mark, Im happy that it working for you:)

MDD plug has a "use Materials of child" check box, Object2Fact plug import very well uv's.

I know what you mean, in C4D we use a "Connect Object" function before to convert it to PLA or MDD so body and clothes are baked in just one geometry with uv's intact. maybe you can look for something similar in DAZ4.

Cheers

Diego

[Mark Johnston]

Hi Here is what I got so far movies 9 ,10 , 11 DAZ MMD EXAMPLES

http://web.me.com/markjohnston99me/markseiasmovies/Movie_9.html

Have a look

Mark

anyone Know how I should use this opacity map I have tried several ways but can't see any difference the way I tried?

Thanks Mark

[RichardJoly]

Congrats on your perseverance Mark, I never could export the genesis model to "fit" the MMD file...

Please explain how you export the model and bring it to EI in details... I'm pulling my hair over this one!

Thanks!

[Mark Johnston]

Hi , Heres the latest test http://web.me.com/markjohnston99me/markseiasmovies/Movie_12.html

Richard when exporting obj be sure your on first frame of animation leave the drop down set to custom. First Frame is 0.

Export at scale of 1 seems to be most important thing

set x y z all just left alone

boxes I clicked see below

When importing object to fact scale of 1

When export the mdd I'am using modo export again select scale of 1

Make sure your mdd is in the socket folder

Import your model

Put pulgin In , selecting your mdd file

parent model to plugin

Hit preview or move timeline cursor to see model move

That should do it.

The new example with clothes on .

In daz I just put the clothes on and I did not parent them

I exported and after some head banging

I put one plugin for each item each plugin still uses same mdd file

Plugin Genesis, plugin shorts, plugin boots, plugin jacket, plugin hair

That worked but I so far can't get the uv texture part right

Thats got me pulling my hair out

Hope that helps Richard

Anyone else out there , can you do some tests and help solve this whole picture.

Thanks Mark

Some comments about the textures the akio model that uvs worked right on. I exported through the texture atlas plugin that came as part of the content creator version of daz that includes FBX exporter, GOz, Texture atlas ect.

The texture atlas and other plugins appear to also be sold each on its own if you don't need all of them.

The texture atlas allows you to combine many texture maps into one map.

If you collect maps when you export from daz it will put maps (that I combined into one map) into a folder but I could not get them to go on correctly by just trying to apply them. The problems getting uvs to work on models still has something to do with transfer of uvs through object to fact but I have no idea how to fix but may could be scale of uv space.

Thanks Mark

[RichardJoly]

Thanks Mark! I'll check it out as soon as I can. This is very promising and could be really helpful in many occasions.

[Mark Johnston]

HI Richard , I have been able to make textures work now its if I can get this version of model to work with the MDD plugin !!!

I exported each model by turning off the eye in Daz for the ones I didn't want to export.

Export genesis export hair export jacket with same settings I showed above for daz export , but

At one time I had exported the whole thing all models at once but I had collected the maps because I had checked that option.

I thought I couldn't get those maps to work but after converting each model with theses settings for object to fact

( see below)

I was able to put each map in its place by just looking at their names but some I couldn't get so I just looked how they were used in Daz surfaces tap when clicking on each part in a menu on the upper left of the interface you then just scroll your mouse over the little boxes in the settings for each thing like diffuse ect. and the maps just pop up as you go over them cool.You have to have use uv space and display textures clicked in the object info windows but the maps were sized correct.

So I placed all maps by hand and then exported models to native fact saving after almost each thing I would change cause a few times ei just quit.

This model is made different so I don't know if it can be made to work with plugin, but if it can I think it could have something to do with the thing in the plugin guide about putting an * in the name of child groups I think it was

or maybe not , Don't Know

Mark

BTW almost any time I try to use mt file in object to fact it quits.

[Mark Johnston]

HI a few more pics. still haven't got it all licked

[RichardJoly]

Mark, lower the specular (a lot) on the model, it will get rid of the plastic look...

I hope I have time to play with it this weekend.

[Mark Johnston]

Hi Richard yeah that would do it and would look a lot better.

So I have learned some things I Think and this is what I think at this point.

In bringing models into eias you can get models to come in as

(METHOD 1)

groups like genesis , jacket , shorts , boots. and you can probably get maps to export through the texture atlas that will work, cause I got maps for jacket, boots, shorts to work but couldn't get the one I made this time for genesis to work, but earlier I had the whole body map for the akio model worked. So you could get the textures to look right but in this method each group would only have one material so thats not perfect, but it works with the one MDD plugin for each group method that I explained above so you can get mdd animation to work.

( METHOD 2)

Bring model in as surfaces or as obj to fact calls it separate by materials in this method all the parts of the model are labeled by the surfaces they have in daz such as torso, limbs , eyes ect.

In this way the maps that are collected when (write materials is checked , write library and collect maps is checked)

and this will work because this is the way they are used in daz. And you have separate control over the materials so you can made model look perfect.

So whats not to like???

The model in this method can not be used by MDD plugin. Because of the way its constructed you can't parent any part of the model and get things to work animator just Quits as soon as you parent any of the parts to it.

If there is some way to make it work , someone can correct me. But this is what I think.

So whats next to look at is this.

This model looks good so what can you do.

Daz also exports BVH files and if you have the FBX plugin it exports fbx.

So not having used these kind of files very much in the past , I'am not sure I could get this to work but .

Obj to fact can use a bvh file to add Hierarchy to model your importing cause obj format does not save Hierarchy.

If you try this from the bvh directly exported from Daz into obj to fact you get warning not a correct bvh file but in the obj to fact guide it says (Hint you have to open file first in eias) because obj to fact can use files but doesn't convert them. So I assume when you open file in eias it converts the file.Then you can use this file in object to fact.

SO now your model could have Hierarchy.

Now I think FBX can not only bring obj models in but also the rig or skeleton and the animation data ?????

But if all you get is rig not animation you still can use bvh file to drive animation.

SO in this method you get perfect look of model and still get animation of model.

Also in the Mdd animation you (got what you got and thats it ) you can't change the animation.

But here you can set up a rigged model to animate your self.

OBJ to fact also will batch convert a folder of models if you set it up to that and it will place the maps for you ( you'd still have to turn on use uv space in the right places.) For obj to fact to find and place maps the model and the maps need to be in the same folder before you convert your model for this to work according to the guide . obj needs to know where the maps are.

I know this should work cause in one of my many tests I've done, this did work.

So this last part of what I have written here I still need you check out and see if this is so.

If I can get it to work.

I Don't know if any of the changes in eias 9 will allow us to use many materials and uv maps on one group like it seems most other programs can, because this is what causes the problems using these model in eias. I wonder if its just a file format deal or the way that the render engine is eias is written . Because to me this has always been a problem for a long time and has never been addressed and goes back to the way they created the rendering engine. Or it's all just about file formats, and can and should be resolved.

At least thats what I think at this point.

Thanks Mark

OH all also Daz has a way to bake material files or something but I have not used this yet , just saw it in one of the windows as I'am exploring it.

[Diego]

The model in this method can not be used by MDD plugin. Because of the way its constructed you can't parent any part of the model and get things to work animator just Quits as soon as you parent any of the parts to it.

Hi Mark,

I see you've made very good progress, I'll take a look at Daz, so far I use PoserPro + Cinema4D to bring animated characters to EIAS, but I read that there is a Motion Capture plugin for Daz directly from Arena that is the software that I use for Motion Capture, so I have to test it.

Please, can you try to use just one MDD instance for each part of your model? or please can you upload your model + MDD file to find a way to make it work?

you are doing a very useful research thanks:)

Cheers

Diego

[Mark Johnston]

HI Diego I Put a bunch of files in a folder called MDD Stuff in my public folder the GEN 1.mdd is almost a gig and goes with Gen 1 obj mt fac files.

I put a smaller new mdd------ GEN Male corner left mdd and exported its Jeremy model in the 4 different ways you can export as

E Groups obj

Nodes groups obj

surfaces group obj

Figure groups obj

Now you can try to covert each of those in obj to fact if you like

All the textures are there for jeremy as they come when you collect maps, in daz.

I also have all the files for the version where I made a separate model for Gen 1 F --Jacket, Shorts, Boots and included the textures I out put through the texture atlas of just the (body UV maps) maps for clothes looked the same as the normal maps that had been collected so I didn't included those ones I put out for each through the texture atlas. This one would still use the GEN 1 MDD file its just models exported separated. Also I put in the texture atlas output files that merge all the uvs for the body and clothes into one map .

So if you want get into it.

As far as one mdd instance for each part of model thats what I did with the Gen as one model, jacket as one model ect.

Other then that I don't see how it could work on a model, made by the model separated by materials method.

Good Luck Mark

https://public.me.com/markjohnston99me

[Mark Johnston]

Hi Diego The Arena system looks great I checked it out after you mentioned it. I want a mac version based on Iphones for cameras hooked up wirelessly with the camera setup too.

If you try any of the files I posted I don't know if those have this problem but I saw on Dazs forum that some people were having artifacts show up after exporting and reimporting the male version of genesis and I saw theses on models I was trying and I think that maybe a reason why some of the uv maps have not been working right for me.

Mark